A LOT with Audra

Ep68
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Creativity as Self Trust
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​[00:00:00]

Audra Dinell: [00:01:00] You guys, today we're talking about creativity. Creativity is not just about making something beautiful. It's about trusting yourself enough to make something true. And in a second act, that truth often gets less polished. Less performative and more honest. We're talking about creativity.

Sorry, let me start that sentence again. Brian. We're talking about creativity as a form of self-trust about what happens when you make things from a more honest place and how art can teach us how to let go play, take risks. And reinvent ourselves in our second act. It feels like for a lot of women, creativity starts as an expression, but over time it becomes something deeper, almost a relationship with yourself.

Meet Jill Nicole Luten
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Audra Dinell: Our guest today is Jill Niko. Sorry, lemme start that again. Brian. Our guest today is Jill Nicole Luten. She's a multidisciplinary artist working [00:02:00] across photographic processes, painting and object making. Her work explores the emotional landscape of motherhood and the evolving sense of self, often through an engagement with beauty, creativity, and daily life.

She is based in Wichita, Kansas, with her partner and daughters. Welcome Jill.

Oh my gosh. So we first met in a really interesting way. I was putting on a series of events for women and. We have some mutual friends and I had seen some of your work online around motherhood and I just thought, you are such a creative, I wanna see if you'll story tell a little bit at one of these events that we were having.

Jill Luton: Yep.

Audra Dinell: And the friendship just sort of blossomed from there. Mm-hmm. And I got to attend one of your playground workshops, which I'm sure we'll dabble in Yeah. Talking about. But I've always admired you for your creativity. You're so sweet. Thank you.

Early Signs of Creativity
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Audra Dinell: Have you always been a creative person or do [00:03:00] you feel like that's something you grew into?

Jill Luton: Looking back, I can see that I've always been a creative person, but I didn't really necessarily see myself as a creative person until I was much older. It kind of reminds me of like the whole, like a fish doesn't know it's swimming in water kind of concept.

Audra Dinell: Yeah.

Jill Luton: When it's so much of like.

A part of the way that you move through the world.

Audra Dinell: Yeah.

Jill Luton: You know you don't realize what you have when it comes so naturally to you.

Audra Dinell: Yes,

Jill Luton: and it's not necessarily that I was doing these outstanding things throughout my whole life and just didn't notice it.

It was more of like, I would. De coloring a lot as a kid or making friendship bracelets. Yeah. Or when I got older I was in choir a lot and I was in choir throughout college. So my, my creative iterations have looked really vast and they can have really low pressure in the sense that [00:04:00] like nobody sees them or they could be higher pressure and be more like in front of other people.

So yeah, it's kind of looked a lot of different ways, but I didn't really notice it. Until I was older, like maybe even like late twenties, early thirties.

Audra Dinell: Okay. I was wondering when that identity shifted for you, because I met you when we were both in our thirties, I think. Yeah. I mean, I'm still technically in my thirties for two more days.

I know. Um, I, I met you as like a creative, so I'm curious like when that shifted for you, when you started to see yourself in a, in a different way.

Food Blog to Photography
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Jill Luton: So when I was living in Durham, North Carolina with Josh, my husband he was attending school there. It was like right after the recession.

Audra Dinell: Mm-hmm.

Jill Luton: And I could not get a job.

Like I had a job when I was living in Wichita, but then moved there and like, I was competing against [00:05:00] people with their masters for like very like. Simple jobs that I was overqualified for, and they definitely were overqualified for.

Audra Dinell: Yeah.

Jill Luton: And I was just like not very happy. I was pretty miserable. I felt like, you know, like I didn't know what my days should look like.

Mm-hmm.

Audra Dinell: And

Jill Luton: so. I started a food blog.

Audra Dinell: Yeah.

Jill Luton: And with that came 'cause because one of my other iterations of creativity was baking. When I first got married, I started baking a lot. And when I would, I would go to the office and ask people what they would want. Like I let them like vote on what I would bake and bring it in.

So I was kind of in a baking kick.

Audra Dinell: Oh, fun.

Jill Luton: So I made a food blog. Did I, I've never told you this again. No. And so then with a food blog comes photography. And my mom had received a camera from my dad years ago that she never used, and I asked if I could have it. And that kind of kickstarted my relationship [00:06:00] with photography.

Audra Dinell: Hmm.

Jill Luton: I was working a temp job at the Duke Chapel. Okay. And in that I would teach myself like the basics of photography. And that, that is, that and a lot of generous other photographers and who were happy to take me under my wing to take me under their wing to learn alongside them. Like those two things together, like allowed for me to kind of like kickstart that journey intentionally.

Audra Dinell: Mm-hmm.

Jill Luton: And I think from then a lot of people would kind of. Talk to me about being creative.

Audra Dinell: Yeah.

Jill Luton: And I think that that's when it kind of, I started to see it. Like I didn't see it until then because I think one, I think it kind of came naturally to me.

Others Reflect Your Gifts
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Jill Luton: And then two so my other kind of funny story in that is that I wasn't like going out and saying like, I am a photographer for hire.

Like, you know, like a wedding photographer, portrait [00:07:00] photographer. Photographer, anything like that. But someone's, someone was getting married and her photographer backed out the week of her wedding. I happened to know her. She knew that I had a food blog, and she asked if I would shoot her wedding. And I was like, I have never shot a moving object before.

Audra Dinell: Yeah.

Jill Luton: You know, like, I don't know if I can do this. And she's like, no, you're creative. You can do this. Like, I totally believe in you doing this. And I think like. Like having enough interactions like that of people being like, oh yes, you are very capable of this. Like,

Audra Dinell: yeah,

Jill Luton: because I didn't necessarily see it as anything special because it was, it's so close to you.

Audra Dinell: Yes.

Jill Luton: And so having people kind of reflect that back to me, I think is when I finally started

Audra Dinell: to get it. Oh, I think that's so relatable. So many of us are just going through the world with our gifts, not realizing their gifts. Yeah. 'cause they're easy for us.

Jill Luton: Mm-hmm.

Audra Dinell: But the power of [00:08:00] the right people pouring into you and speaking life into you and just calling out what they see in you is unmatched.

Jill Luton: Yeah, I mean, and also, I mean like what a brazen concept. Like this person's getting married, she's, I mean, like, that's like a lot of bravery in her heart.

Audra Dinell: Oh my gosh, yes.

Jill Luton: And you know, like, and really I'm not typically a person who says yes. I am much more the person to say no.

Audra Dinell: Mm-hmm.

Jill Luton: But in this world I can sometimes say yes.

Audra Dinell: Mm.

Jill Luton: It's easy for me to say yes when it's just me. Mm-hmm. Like when I'm, what I mean by that is like, to be brave, to put myself out there, to explore things, to, to try and potentially fail. I'm really good at that when I'm by myself and in my creative world.

Audra Dinell: Yeah.

Jill Luton: But whenever it involves other people, then sometimes, you know, I'm still not as brave as I'd like to be.

I'm getting braver all the time. All the time. And I think my thirties have, and now that I'm [00:09:00] in my forties, you know, I'm just moving into that direction. But it's not, it does not come naturally for me to be brave and say yes.

Audra Dinell: Mm. I think it's really telling though, that in the creative world, those were your easiest yeses.

Jill Luton: Yes. I kind of have talked about this before with you and other conversations that we've had. But my relationship with creativity really inform, like, informs who I feel like at my core.

Audra Dinell: Yeah.

Jill Luton: Kind of the rise of my creativity, like my intentional like. Choosing to call myself an artist. Yeah.

Motherhood Therapy and Core Self
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Jill Luton: And choosing to go after things in an artistic way came along the same time as motherhood.

Audra Dinell: Mm.

Jill Luton: As well as therapy.

Audra Dinell: Mm. Oh.

Jill Luton: And I remember in therapy being asked, when do you feel the most like you?

And I, I would say when I'm [00:10:00] making things, like, when I'm being creative,

When I have the camera in my hand, or when I am painting or when I am.

When I'm just engaging in that world, I, I don't get scared of things that I typically get scared of. I don't get, you know, neurotic about things. I don't I don't know. It, it, it, it's like the, the easiest thing for me in that world

To be able to. Be curious and calm and confident and creative and, you know, all of the C's, I, I forget the, oh, who is it?

It, there's a, there's someone in the therapy world that has like the seven C's. And there, those are among them. Okay. And it's like your core self.

Audra Dinell: We've talked about this and I can't remember the model you're referring to either.

Jill Luton: Yeah, I can't either. Right now

Audra Dinell: I see that because I, I even think when I'm, I'm saying creative or artist, but it's [00:11:00] not, I mean, this conversation isn't just pertinent to someone who wants to be an artist or a writer or a creative vocationally.

No. It's the way you pull together outfits or you style a room, right? Like I feel like we've. Bonded over that a little bit.

Jill Luton: Mm-hmm.

Audra Dinell: Is it just, is that core, core part of you? When do you feel most connected to your creative self?

Seeing Creativity Everywhere
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Jill Luton: I think when I'm most present. Because.

When I think about creativity, I also don't think about just my creativity. I think about my willingness to see the creativity around Me too.

Audra Dinell: Yeah.

Jill Luton: So, one tends to be able to do that when they're really there in the moment.

Audra Dinell: Yeah.

Jill Luton: So like. Finding the tiny wildflower amongst the grass.

Audra Dinell: Yeah.

Jill Luton: To, you know, see the dappled light coming through, [00:12:00] you know, when the sun is setting, you know, those kinds of things.

And that sounds so hokey and corny, but honestly they delight me.

Audra Dinell: Yeah.

Jill Luton: Like it is, like it makes my life so much richer.

Audra Dinell: Yeah.

Jill Luton: And I think that it also informs my creativity.

It,

Audra Dinell: It all just kind of like,

circles around itself. Flows together.

Jill Luton: Yeah.

Audra Dinell: You know, it feels so good to me to hear you say that because I, I hope that that's the gift that I give my kids.

I'm constantly pointing out just like the beauty in the world. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. Poking at creativity in different ways. I remember one conversation with my best friend and she was on her way to med school, so just totally different, you know, brain and mindset. And we were in the car, I don't, I don't remember exactly how old we were in our twenties, and I was talking about how I was a creative, and she explained to me that she'd never thought of me as a creative because she thought being creative meant painting uhhuh [00:13:00] or.

Being an artist

Jill Luton: mm-hmm.

Audra Dinell: Formally in some way with, you know, what am I trying to say? Like pencils and tools. Oh,

Jill Luton: I know.

Audra Dinell: A

Jill Luton: visual artist

Audra Dinell: or being a visual artist.

Jill Luton: Yes. Or, or, you know, a dancer or being an actor, you know? Right. Like Yeah. Those, those that

Audra Dinell: stamps.

Jill Luton: Yeah. Yeah.

Audra Dinell: Mm-hmm. And I remember explaining to her how I thought of creativity and how that it was actually everything.

It was

Jill Luton: mm-hmm.

Audra Dinell: Different ways of thinking of things or explaining things or just. Being in the world, and so I love that. You know, you're talking about being so present and spotting that not just in yourself, but totally in the outside world, because that's speaking of motherhood and art and therapy.

That's just a gift that I hope I pass on to my kids. Like I hope that's just seeped in to them about being with me is, oh, mom would always be quick to point out. Mm-hmm. You know, the beauty in this or the creativity in [00:14:00] this?

Jill Luton: Yeah. My girls are very, and what's like, been such a blessing is like in me doing that for them.

They now do that for me, which is like, I absolutely. Love that they know if there's a good sunset happening outside of our house, like mom's gonna wanna know.

Audra Dinell: Yeah. Yeah.

Jill Luton: And they make sure to tell me or go look at the moon or Yes. You know, like they, they're, or I was outta town last week and my daughter.

On, you know, my husband's phone sent me a picture of a cloud formation. She thought I'd like, you know, like things like that. And like that it gets to be like, once again, this thing that circles around each other, I give to them, they give to me in that way. And you know, I don't think you do it with that intention.

Right,

Audra Dinell: right.

Jill Luton: But wow. What a treat.

Redefining What Counts
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Jill Luton: I really think that it would be to everyone's benefit. If they could see themselves [00:15:00] with the lens of creativity.

Audra Dinell: Mm.

Jill Luton: Because I do believe that everyone has a creative something.

Audra Dinell: Yeah.

Jill Luton: Like, for my husband, like he, I don't think he considered himself a creative

Audra Dinell: Mm.

Jill Luton: Even though he was a musician for most of his life, and also an amazing writer.

Mm-hmm. You know, like, it ha it was like the, like, people don't understand that it can be so much more broad than that. In my mind, creativity is when something didn't exist and now it does.

Audra Dinell: Hmm.

Jill Luton: You know, like that's what someone who creates does.

Audra Dinell: Yeah.

Jill Luton: And so I, I love that you push into that because I think more of a should.

Audra Dinell: It just gives more permission. I think in life you get to define what creativity means to you. You get to define what a lot of things mean to you. But so often we think about just the, the labels or the definitions we've received.

Jill Luton: Yeah.

Audra Dinell: When it is so much more black and white than that, it's full, full spectrum [00:16:00] color.

Jill Luton: Yes. Yeah. It's not black and white at all. Mm-hmm. It's, it's, it is like, it's the like, however you want to have that exist. It can, and like maybe I'm biased because I am more of a visual artist and aesthetics and stuff like that is my jam.

Audra Dinell: Mm-hmm.

Jill Luton: I think everybody kind of wants to be considered creative.

Audra Dinell: Hmm.

Jill Luton: I think that it's a compliment and maybe, maybe not though. 'cause I'm only one person, but like, I don't know. Like everybody wants to be considered smart.

Audra Dinell: It's like not considering yourself a runner. Unless you've run a marathon, right? It's like if you run around the block you are running.

Great. Yes. You are a runner, technically Uhhuh in that moment. Yeah, I, I can, I can totally see that. I love that.

Jill Luton: Yeah.

Why Play Fuels Creativity
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Audra Dinell: Okay, so tell me, what does play have to do with creativity? And where I'm going with this question is you had these amazing series of playground workshops and I got to take one with former mentioned best [00:17:00] friend.

Yes. And we had just the best time, but I have found. Play seeping from my life, like my thirties, really. I reduced the amount of things that felt playful to me. I mean, you know, I played with my kids. Yeah. But play is such an important part.

Jill Luton: Yeah. Okay. So first playing creativity. I really don't feel like creativity can exist without play.

otherwise. How do you grow, how do you experiment? How can anything be made if you're not willing to see what this looks like if you do this or, you know? I really feel like play is, inherent to the creative process.

And then I believe that the creative process can be really the creative process slash play.

Both of them can be really beneficial to one's wellbeing.

[00:18:00] And I'm not like, this isn't me saying this. This is a bunch of scientists and researchers who have found that this to be true.

Audra Dinell: Yeah.

Jill Luton: Of how beneficial it is. And yes, I think that we live in a culture that is about achieving things and play inherently doesn't.

And I think. As

Audra Dinell: we grow and we start building our lives and we're looking around and we're trying to figure out what success means to us, some of us live like that. Some of us just, take the definition that we were given.

Jill Luton: Mm-hmm.

Audra Dinell: But I, I think it's very easy to let, let play, go down the drain because we feel like it's frivolous.

It's not efficient.

Jill Luton: I mean, like, society is not structured in a way to cont encourage us to play.

Audra Dinell: Right.

Jill Luton: So like, it's not. Surprising that it ends up that way.

Audra Dinell: Oh, I agree. It's

Jill Luton: not

surprising at

Audra Dinell: all. You know, it's sort of like a fight, like it's a

Jill Luton: battle of like you have to battle. It has to be an intentional choice to do it.

Audra Dinell: [00:19:00] Yes. Yes.

Play as Adult and Mom
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Jill Luton: And for me, like just to say like kind of like wrapping it back into motherhood, like I applaud all of the mothers who play with their kids so easily. Yeah. 'cause that actually was not an easy thing for me to do with my kids.

Audra Dinell: Me either.

Jill Luton: And so. For me to be able to play with them in another way.

Started with creativity, started with, you know, a lot of messy things, you know?

Audra Dinell: Yeah.

Jill Luton: And that was an easy way of connecting with them. I think that, you know, as previously mentioned, it's a really easy way of connecting with myself.

I wish that I, I wish I would've written down some of the statistics about play because it, it's good for self-confidence.

It's good for the intu intuition. Mm. It's good for problem solving.

Audra Dinell: Mm-hmm.

Jill Luton: It has an ability to like, you know, obviously lift your spirit, but also it, it lets you often [00:20:00] connect with others too.

Audra Dinell: Yeah.

Jill Luton: So, I don't know.

Audra Dinell: It's important. It sort of gets you off the achievement wheel and gets you more into the present and.

The people and like the feeling part of life.

Jill Luton: Mm-hmm.

Books That Spark Play
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Audra Dinell: I'm thinking of several books that both you and I like. Maybe those would be great to share.

Jill Luton: Oh yes,

Audra Dinell: I know. Big Magic. Oh yeah. Elizabeth Big Magic Elizabeth Gilbert. Mm-hmm. Is, is one. What's another book on play that you recommend?

Jill Luton: Okay. It's not technically on play.

It is called Joyful by Ingrid Feder Lee. But it's more about the aesthetics of joy. But in that. There is talk about play in there.

Audra Dinell: I must read that, that like I follow her. I, God, it's so good. Get her newsletter. I just have never read that one.

Jill Luton: It's so good. It, and I think that it, it's one of those ones that does a good job of opening you up to the present.

Audra Dinell: Mm. The War of Art by Steve Pressfield. That's what I'm currently reading.

Jill Luton: Okay.

Audra Dinell: And it is so [00:21:00] good. He takes the lens of writing as your form of art. Mm-hmm. Make several references in the book about, it's not just the writing or the music, maybe it's starting a business.

Jill Luton: Mm-hmm.

Audra Dinell: Just your art is your art, but he talks about resistance and basically like the war of what the world tells you to do and what forces are gonna kind of like pull you to do and like what you need to do to be present and open yourself up to play and creativity.

So good?

Jill Luton: Yeah.

Audra Dinell: Mm. Okay. So.

Pressure Versus Play
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Audra Dinell: What does play make possible? That pressure never could.

Jill Luton: Hmm.

I feel like pressure.

Okay. When I think about this. Okay. So you're able to create in both environments. You know, like you're able to produce in both environments.

Audra Dinell: Mm.

Jill Luton: But the feeling that you're gonna have [00:22:00] when creating those, that whatever it is that you're creating

Audra Dinell: mm-hmm.

Jill Luton: Is gonna feel very different.

Audra Dinell: Mm.

Jill Luton: When it comes with pressure, I mean, it's going to take a lot of the, the benefit out of the creative process.

Audra Dinell: Yeah.

Jill Luton: That doesn't mean that there can't be something wonderful created out of it.

Audra Dinell: Yeah.

Jill Luton: But

and there's a time and place.

Audra Dinell: Yeah.

Jill Luton: I had an art show last year that, I felt a lot of pressure to get things done.

Audra Dinell: Yeah. There was a real timeline. People were gonna really walk in those doors.

Jill Luton: Right? Yeah. Yeah. And, and where I kind of sit with that is that, you know, there's a time and place it was important for me to do this art show and kind of the more enjoyable part of the creating.

Came kind of in the ideas phase.

Audra Dinell: Mm-hmm.

Jill Luton: And so, you know, where pressure, you know, like the whole time and place is that where it doesn't belong is, you know, when you're supposed to demand something, I think [00:23:00] from your creativity.

Audra Dinell: Mm.

Jill Luton: Well, I don't know. I mean, I. Come from a position where my creativity does not, is not like a breadwinning situation in my life.

Audra Dinell: Yeah.

Jill Luton: But I know for many people that is how they have to view their creativity.

Audra Dinell: Mm-hmm.

Jill Luton: So I wanna say that with, some nuance of, there's a time and place and for people who have to do that for me and the way that I've had to view my creativity is that I can't have it be my. Source of income.

Audra Dinell: Yeah.

Jill Luton: Because of the fact that it already provides for me in other ways.

Audra Dinell: Mm.

Jill Luton: And that that's okay with for me.

Audra Dinell: Yeah.

Jill Luton: That works for my family.

Audra Dinell: Yeah.

Jill Luton: You know, not that I'm opposed to it. Yeah. And producing, you know, I would love for people to buy my work. I mostly because I want them to.

Feel connected enough that it brings them joy that they want to.

Audra Dinell: Yeah.

Jill Luton: [00:24:00] You want your art to live out into the world. That's a lot of reason why people create,

Making Creativity Sustainable
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Audra Dinell: you know, and I almost think being a person who, who does financially benefit from the creativity that I put out to the world.

Right? Yes. And that's. The seat that I'm in, I, I think it can shift too. I think that's the beautiful thing is when there, first of all, when I started the thread, I mean, it just overtook me. It was such a beautiful passion. I spent a ton of time on it and I was so happy doing that. And also I kept contract that paid me to do executive recruiting.

I kept it for the first full year of developing the thread until I could. Allow some pressure to be put on the business, and now I feel like my shift creatively has been into writing on Substack or doing the podcast. Yeah. So I sort of think it is more fun when it is [00:25:00] not super pressure filled. Yeah. So maybe that is in the ideation stage.

Yeah. It's not like in the nitty gritty, but that that could come.

Jill Luton: Mm-hmm.

Audra Dinell: For me it did. And so for me, it's been important to dabble in other ways of creativity. If not, I just feel so bottled up or like remodeling my bathroom.

Jill Luton: Yeah. Yes.

Audra Dinell: Things like that.

Jill Luton: Yeah. I do feel like that is true for me too in the sense of like, even from like, just like an, like, let's just talk about a visual artist standpoint.

Like, I primarily am a photographer 'cause that was my first love.

Audra Dinell: Mm-hmm.

Jill Luton: But I also paint and I crochet. Mm-hmm. And I like to decorate my house and all those things. And, and they all kind of inform each other, but like, if you're getting burnt out in one area

Audra Dinell: Yeah.

Jill Luton: Or you're feeling overwhelmed in one area, it's like pendulate, you know?

Yeah. Go

Audra Dinell: elsewhere. Yep.

Jill Luton: And, and you know, to your point of like, the [00:26:00] creative process can be both in like a, pressure thing and not, you know, and, and knowing, knowing that lane of what you want out of it. But you know, like with what we were talking about previously with play is like that is probably not gonna be put within the pressure lane

Audra Dinell: Yeah.

Jill Luton: At that time.

Audra Dinell: Yeah.

Jill Luton: And so being able to remodel your bathroom

Audra Dinell: Yeah.

Jill Luton: Or to have a crochet project or to watercolor or whatever that doesn't have it with it, I think can help. When you have the pressure in the other areas.

Audra Dinell: Yeah.

Trust Yourself And Share
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Audra Dinell: So this season of the podcast, we're talking all about second acts, and one thing that keeps coming up in many conversations is like listening to our inner voices, being present, trusting ourselves.

What does it look like to trust yourself in a creative effort?

Jill Luton: I think for me. [00:27:00] Trusting myself in a creative project comes in two different main ways. One, letting myself be curious and play.

Audra Dinell: Mm-hmm.

Jill Luton: Like letting that be okay.

Audra Dinell: Mm-hmm.

Jill Luton: And I think the other one is like being bold enough to share what you make. I don't think that everything you make needs to be shared.

Audra Dinell: Mm-hmm.

Jill Luton: But at the same time, like, I think that, you know, it it for me personally, like it takes the boldness of being willing to share it. Well, it gives permission to others to share those parts of them. I think, you know, it's, I love that you said it like that. 'cause I never have thought about it like that.

Hmm. For me, I. Kind of just, I, I know this is not like the most positive way of [00:28:00] looking at it, but this is real for me, is I kind of just assume that nobody really cares to see it. Yeah,

Audra Dinell: yeah.

Jill Luton: It's special to me because it's mine.

Audra Dinell: Yeah.

Jill Luton: And that it won't make an impact on other people.

But I remember my sister-in-law one time saying like, don't assume that, like, why

Audra Dinell: would you assume

Jill Luton: that?

Audra Dinell: See, I have to, I actually adopt that mindset too, and I have to assume that. To put the workout into the world. I just have to assume that. I'm creating this, I'm gonna give it my best effort and do it my way.

Mm-hmm. Because if I get worried about performing

Jill Luton: Yeah.

Audra Dinell: Then I'm gonna be researching what's the best way to do it, this and that. Mm. And then it's not gonna actually be like my art, my creativity, my work.

Jill Luton: Yeah.

Audra Dinell: And so I have to pretend that literally no one listens to the podcast. That no one sees the things.

Oh, I see

Jill Luton: what you're

Audra Dinell: saying

Jill Luton: now. Okay.

Audra Dinell: To be able to put it out. Yeah. But then I think that act of putting it out. Gives permission. I know. You know, seeing other people do things out in the world has [00:29:00] helped me to see, oh, well they're doing it. I wonder if I could do it.

Jill Luton: I know. You know, and I think that that's such a generous.

Like, I, I don't know why that's not intuitively how I look at it, because like, you're right. When I see other people doing it, I'm like, I'm not particularly critical. You know, like I'm pretty excited when I see other people doing cool things.

Audra Dinell: Yeah.

Jill Luton: You know, but like, or even not

Audra Dinell: that cool of things,

Jill Luton: you

Audra Dinell: know,

Jill Luton: like

Audra Dinell: just kind of benign things.

Jill Luton: Right. It's

Audra Dinell: still

Jill Luton: like you're

Audra Dinell: out there, you're in the arena. Yeah. You're doing it.

Jill Luton: Yeah. Yeah. And so, but for whatever reason, that's really a hurdle that I struggle with. Hmm.

Going Big To Be Seen
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Audra Dinell: I think a lot of us struggle with putting things out into the world and

Jill Luton: yeah, I think that that is why I will give myself like big projects.

Audra Dinell: Oh yeah. So you're like, I'm just gonna go big.

Jill Luton: Yeah. I really though, 'cause otherwise I won't do it. So like, if it's like, oh, just, you know, just share the thing that you like that you made on Instagram. I'm [00:30:00] like, I won't do it. So I have to like have a solo show or I have to, you know, like have a year of self portraits.

Yes. Or I have to, you know, like I have to give myself a reason to share, otherwise I'm not gonna do

Audra Dinell: it.

Jill Luton: Yeah.

Year Of Self Portraits
---

Jill Luton: I was thinking about your year of self-portraits. Yeah. We'll link your substack to this podcast episode because I loved it so much. You know, I really did too. I mean, self-portraits are I mean, gosh, if anybody is struggling with who they feel like they are, I feel like self-portraits is such a gift you can give yourself because you're saying you're worthy of being in front of the camera.

Audra Dinell: Mm-hmm.

Jill Luton: You're worthy of being seen. And you can like really kind of dig into what's going on. You know?

I don't even know what to say underneath all of it. Yeah.

One Word A Month Method
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Jill Luton: Like, because for me it started with words. I started with one word a month.

Audra Dinell: [00:31:00] Okay.

Jill Luton: That was just cut my eye. It was just a word that I liked and it wasn't even like trying to be some big planned thing. Each month I pick a word and then I respond to it, and almost every time it's the right word and there's so much meaning into it.

And then to get to have the, you know, so that's one piece of it. And I would always write it after I did the self-portrait.

Audra Dinell: Okay.

Jill Luton: But then with the self-portrait itself. I would have the word and then I would have these, you know, visual concepts that came up in my mind and I would pursue those according to, you know, what I was capable of, my timeframe, whatever.

Audra Dinell: Yeah.

Jill Luton: And like sometimes they worked out amazingly and exactly how I thought in my mind. Yeah. And sometimes not at all, but whatever was always felt right.

Audra Dinell: Oh. This is actually the biggest gift I think of this podcast episode, is the idea that if someone is stepping into like a second act for themself, whether it be a new [00:32:00] decade or a new season of life, motherhood a new job, whatever, transition, a second act, a way to really celebrate that and like boldly take agency over that would be to do this year of self portraits.

Oh my gosh. Pick a word.

Jill Luton: Yes.

Audra Dinell: I

Jill Luton: think it was a word a month. Like

Audra Dinell: one word A month.

Jill Luton: Yeah.

Audra Dinell: So you'd pick a word a month, you would create in your mind an image.

Jill Luton: Yes.

Audra Dinell: And then you, obviously, you're a photographer, so you could do self portraits. Yes.

Non Photographer Options
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Audra Dinell: How could someone do this that's not an actual photographer?

Jill Luton: Hmm.

You know, I think that maybe for someone who doesn't have, you know, practice skilled with, you know, a visual art form.

Audra Dinell: Mm-hmm.

Jill Luton: What if you made a Pinterest board? Oh, I love that. You know what, if you found an image that really felt like it spoke to it, and then what, what, what about it? Why, why about that?

What did you notice? Like what was it about [00:33:00] it that pulled you to it and like dig into it, like there's gonna be a lot underneath there that you aren't even aware of.

Audra Dinell: Oh, yeah. So tap into your form. Your medium. Yeah. If you are not,

Jill Luton: yeah, I mean a

Audra Dinell: photographer

Jill Luton: or I, I think that, I mean, it could be abstract painting, it could be, it could be anything.

Audra Dinell: Yeah. But poetry,

Jill Luton: I will say, yeah, poetry. Yes, poetry, which I'm not even a big, I'm not big into poetry.

Audra Dinell: Yeah.

Jill Luton: But when the right poem lands, and if that is something that speaks to like a, typically, I think that my encouragement would be to stick to one thing.

Audra Dinell: Okay. For the whole year

Jill Luton: I would, yeah, love this.

Like really get, get used to like seeing through whatever medium that you've chosen to do it in. And I would say please, more of you be brave enough to get in front of the camera because I think that it really produces more confidence. And I should say too, [00:34:00] this was a gift that was given to me. By seeing other people do self-portraits.

Audra Dinell: Okay,

Jill Luton: so one, there is a very well known photographer named Jamie Beck, who has moved to Provence in France and had did all these self-portraits. And they're phenomenal and her style's very different than mine in, you know, she is so like her own thing. Mm. You know. And but seeing her do it made me curious about doing it.

Audra Dinell: Oh, fun.

Jill Luton: But then on top of that a gal that I met at a photography conference, because I did used to be a photographer for hire. 'cause you know, like that whole thing did lead into that.

Audra Dinell: Okay. Okay. Yeah.

Jill Luton: But, she invited me to do a year of self portraits with her and some other women.

Audra Dinell: Okay.

Jill Luton: And, but it was more intense 'cause it was every week.

Audra Dinell: Oh wow.

Jill Luton: And it was like you wrote a response and it was all within the [00:35:00] group, so it wasn't public.

Audra Dinell: Yeah.

Jill Luton: But like, that experience alone was just like really powerful. And, and I think that, you know, I really have to give a shout out to Shay for, you know, inviting me into that.

Audra Dinell: Hmm. That's such a gift.

Small Creative Practice
---

Audra Dinell: Okay, so as we close our conversation, tell me, for those people listening who may not feel like an artist, what would one small, honest, creative practice look like in their real full lives?

What is one thing they could do?

I'd say let yourself be curious about that thing that you

Jill Luton: wanna try. Like, I know that not everyone leans towards the arts, but if you have any even inkling of it, let yourself try it and, and really be prepared to not succeed at it, because that is another thing that we really didn't talk about very much in [00:36:00] this, is that in letting yourself play.

That means you let go of the expectation of what a, the end result is.

Audra Dinell: Mm.

Jill Luton: You can't have a, hard grasp on what you want the end result to be and still stay open.

Audra Dinell: Yeah.

Jill Luton: And that was true for all of the self-portraits. Even if I had a vision, if it wasn't working, you have to let go.

Audra Dinell: Yeah.

Jill Luton: And so like, learning how to go after something loosely. And boldly with lots of curiosity and

Audra Dinell: little expectations.

Jill Luton: And, I think that's gonna be how you enter that doesn't mean that's how you have to stay.

Audra Dinell: Yeah.

Jill Luton: You can change, the modes that you exist in your creativity based off of what the need is, but like to get into it, let it be low pressure, let it be fun.

Let it be. Just curious. And you could throw it away.

Audra Dinell: Yeah.

Jill Luton: Or never [00:37:00] tell anyone you did it.

Audra Dinell: Yeah. Let your curiosity lead.

Jill Luton: Yeah.

Audra Dinell: So good.

Where To Find Jill
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Audra Dinell: Okay, Jill, where can our listeners find you?

Jill Luton: You can find me on Instagram where I don't share as much as I should as previously mentioned at sincerely, Jill, as well as Jill.

Nicole Luton. And then I also have a website. That's jill nicole luton.com. Yeah.

Audra Dinell: Thank you so much for conversation. Yay.

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